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Ape in the coat's avatar

> However, this way of thinking very obviously begs the question against moral realism, which necessarily involves the belief that (at least some) widespread moral judgments really do come from making contact with objective, mind-independent moral facts. If you think that sort of picture is reasonable, then the truth of the moral judgments in question doesn’t need to come from natural selection — those judgments will already be justified by whatever independently truth-tracking ability the realist has in mind, and natural selection just explains why that ability became widespread over time.

Let's grant, for the sake of argument, that there are mind-independent moral facts.

The question then is, where would the ability to make contact with them come from? How would this truth-tracking ability happen to exist in humans?

I'm going to postulate an extremely controvercial thing here - about as controvercial as Trump not being the best possible statesman: all our mental properties are result of evolution through natural selection. If humans have some truth-tracking ability regarding the moral facts - it has to be evolved. And so if our moral intuitions have evolved, and the process that was guiding our evolution was not optimizing for correspondance to objective morality, then it's quite reasonable to assume that we are wrong about the moral facts.

> When we say, for example, that the long-necked-ness of giraffes is the result of natural selection, we are saying, roughly, that the ancestors of giraffes were such that, those among them who had slightly longer necks than the others tended to produce more offspring, and that this led to a situation where a greater and greater proportion of the creatures that were born had long necks, which eventually led to the long-necked giraffes that exist now existing instead of some other creatures with shorter necks. This is a claim about the process that led to there being individuals who had the trait in question, not a claim about the process that led to these individuals having this trait.

It's very much both.

Trump rally analogy is is a bit confusing. Here is where it breaks. Suppose that this particular Trump rally didn't take place. As a result there wouldn't be this congregation of Trump-supporters - True. These supporters, however, would still exist, however, because it wasn't this particular rally that turned them into Trump supporters.

Now, suppose that evolution through natural selectin didn't take place in our universe. Would there still be any individuals with long-neck-ness trait or, for that matter any necks at all? No, there wouldn't be. Because evolution through natural selection is directly causally responsible for them.

> So regardless of whether we end up calling that sort of process a predicative explanation or not, a more robust predicative reading — one that frames evolutionary pressures as literally “changing our minds” from one judgment to another — is pretty clearly off the table.

It's technically true that evolution doesn't make a divine intervention every time I'm thinking "What is the right thing to do"? But neither it needs to. Because evolution through natural selection has designed my mind to think the way it thinks.

Consider how we arrive to our moral judgement. There is this explicit reasoning going on, reflecting on our knowledge about the world, but ultimately it bottoms up in our core moral intuitions. These intuitions are the result of natural selection.

Drew Raybold's avatar

Your first quote from Hanson is problematic, as its summary of natural selection omits two key concepts from evolutionary theory: firstly, the reproductive inheritance of traits with variation, and secondly (ironically) the process and role of selection itself. Consequently,the conclusion of this passage, "this is a claim about the process that led to there being individuals who had the trait in question, not a claim about the process that led to these individuals having this trait", is, at the very least, irrelevant: the complete theory of evolution by natural selection makes empirically-justified claims both about the process that led to there being individuals who had the trait in question, and also about the process that led to these individuals having this trait.

Armed with a proper conception of evolutionary theory, we can see that the Trump-rally analogy is not an analogy at all - and if it were, Hanson's argument would be "devastating" not just for EDAs, but also for the theory of biological evolution by natural selection. Beware of arguments that prove too much!

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